Charlie Hebdo arrives in the UK

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Post by Stirky on Thu Jan 15, 2015 4:45 pm

Copies of Charlie Hebdo will go on sale here in the UK in the morning, with it's very controversial cover. The world is still in shock of what happened a the magazines office, and the events that followed. Of course there has been outrage over the attacks which should never have happened. But should the magazine printed this cover in the aftermath? We haven't really discussed the events here so I thought I'd give you my thoughts on it, which you may not agree with!

Well firstly I want to say that ANY attacks or killings of course are never right or justified, never! What these gunmen did in the name of their religion was wrong on so many levels, I hate that extremists seem to think that in the name of their religion it is right to carry out such horrific acts. But they are extremists, you can not tar all people with the same brush. Just because somebody is Muslim it does not make them a bad person, a terrorist or a murderer. I hate the way these extremists are pushing a bigger and bigger wedge between people, religions and cultures. There is a big divide happening, which of course is what the extremists want! We are all playing into their hands.

But still the extremists are the minority. I wish people would look at things with wider eyes, we are all human. Every person killed regardless of colour, creed or religion is somebody's son, husband, father, daughter, wife, mother. We are all made of the same stuff. We should not let the terrorists drive a wider wedge between us. They are building hate, which gives them more cause to do what they do.

Now I agree with the freedom of speech, but sometimes that freedom of speech needs to be given some thought. You need to know when to shut your mouth before you offend somebody, everybody knows to do this in real life. If you see a lady walking down the road wearing a dress that you think is hideous, you do not run up to her and tell her so, you know that would cause offense and upset her. Maybe if you knew the lady well, you might politely tell her so, but not to a total stranger. So my point is, why is it ok to mock a religion? They caused offence by doing this before, so why again and again? Maybe it would have been better to say, no lets not go down that road again as we will upset people. Religion is a very emotive subject to a lot of people, I know I would not be very happy if people were making fun of my religion. Just as if somebody was making fun out of a member of our family, we would stand up against that. I see France as rather hypocritical to be honest, this is a country that says they want freedoms and should be able to say/print what they like, but on the other hand this is a country that had banned the wearing of all religious articles (clothing/jewellery) in it's schools, and it has also banned the wearing of the hijab and burka from it's streets. Surely in a country that prides itself in it's freedoms then this banning is a bit odd???

I am deeply saddened these events took place, I wish the human race would not fight one another and there would be no need for wars and terrorists attacks. Sadly we do not live in that world. But I also feel people should not provoke others by causing what they knew would offend and upset. It's not as if it was put out there accidently, they knew it would cause a reaction just like the front cover of their latest publication. Yes we all need to stand up for what is right, but sometimes we also need to know when to back off a little.


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Post by Rockhopper on Thu Jan 15, 2015 5:28 pm

It does need some thought Stirkles. With great freedoms comes even greater responsibilities. No-one is relieved of the responsibility of what one says. Make a speech that incites a riot and see what happens!

I am no fan of Charlie Hebdo nor am I interested in their brand of sick humour. Nor am I agreeable with the response by the brothers either. Both were/are over-the-top.

Islam is a way of life to it's followers, they live it, breathe it 24hrs a day. Something that we don't often understand.

France is a strange country filled with very strange people. It has two economies, one for the European French and another for the immigrants. Most of the latter came from Algeria and are Muslim. They are treated very badly in general and have few opportunities to advance much above the poverty level they live in.

Tim.
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Post by Mordae on Fri Jan 16, 2015 12:22 am

It's probably fair to say that the winners of that exchange were the extremists on both sides
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Post by Agartha on Fri Jan 16, 2015 4:03 am

I cannot stand Charlie Hebdo, I find their cartoons nasty and I think they are BIG bigots! Having said that, there was no reason to kill them, no reason.

I couldn't believe that they went ahead and posted another cartoon of Mohammed, knowing the reaction they would get. I am also appalled at Muslims all around asking for all cartoonist to be hanged.

We need to understand that Muslims do live their religion without even thinking about it, just like Rock said. But they need to understand that for us he was not a prophet and that we do love to have a laugh at ourselves and everybody else all the time... I do not agree with being rude to others, I don't agree with the cartoons, but I strongly disagree with killing anybody about it. One of the cartoons they printed one day was about baby Jesus having sex with big bearded Jesus, I think that is disgusting but I never saw any Christians trying to kill them for that.

Also, I don't understand how their prophet Mohammed can be offended  by a drawing of a man who could look like anybody in the Middle East, but not offended by all the female mutilation that happens within Muslim communities, mutilation that happens to little girls under the age of 10.

I agree with Stirky, there is a big divide happening... and it seems that the future looks a lot to be about 'us' and 'them' which is very sad.
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Post by Stargate on Fri Jan 16, 2015 5:23 am

I also join the voices that cry shame on Allah for intolerance to provocation that shows a lack of control. On the other hand I do not know how I would react if I walked into a room and found my wife involved with another man. I am human and I can tolerate so much and no more. I am not sure what is to be expected if one knows the weakness of someone and deliberately goes out of their way to provoke that weakness. France was looking for that response by going that route, no one can attack someones deepest emotions and expect no response. If Allah is telling his followers to kill everyone that insults him, he is no better than the idiots that insulted him. So where do we go from here?

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Post by Agartha on Fri Jan 16, 2015 6:20 am

That is the million dollar question, Stargate: where do we go from here? I can't stand either side of this problem anymore, can't stand the bigots that tease others by offending their beliefs, and I can't stand those that damage their own and others for a religion without even thinking. 

Where do we go from here?
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Post by Stirky on Fri Jan 16, 2015 7:15 am

Is it too late to make a turn around? The media does not help one little bit, the media just makes the wedge between people bigger. They cause hype and fear monger, they report untruths. Of course people listen and believe all of it. The divide is getting bigger and hate is growing. There are a lot of people that just love a fight no matter what the cause is, ask them what they are fighting for and they probably wouldn't even know. They like to cause trouble. The extremists will provoke a reaction, and then people filled with hate and fear will fight against it, just ultimately causing more problems.

I feel that after 14 years of this so called war on terror, that there has been a turning point and not for the good. The extremists seem to have people where they want them now. I also think people are generally more racist now then they used to be, you hear a lot more hatred just generally directed at certain communities. It is awful. Here in the UK the once not very well supported right wing political parties are rising in popularity, due to what I see as race and culture issues. These parties in my eyes are dangerous and ran by the biggest bigots you will ever come across, if they get too much say and influence on the way our country is run in the upcoming general election, then well I think our country is in trouble!
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Post by Agartha on Fri Jan 16, 2015 9:51 am

Stirks, you just said what my sister and I were discussing the other day. Extremists have people where they want them and, like Mordae said, extremists on both sides. This attack in France will probably cause another war somewhere else and will increase the government surveillance on all of us....... David Cameron has already said that if he wins he will try to ban whatsapp and snapchat as they are encrypted and cannot be accessed, they cannot read our messages.

In my ideal world people would get along despite of their differences.... differences are beautiful, they can enrich us, they don't have to be a negative experience.... ~sighs~
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Post by Stirky on Fri Jan 16, 2015 9:55 am

The right wing parties scare me! If they win too many seats at the election, we are in trouble, be a whole lot worse than Cameron!
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Post by Stargate on Fri Jan 16, 2015 11:46 am

The only thing we can do is not to let our minds be contaminated with garbage from external forces we do not know and cannot trust. I hardly go any place online anymore except here on the Island. I am very satisfied to share my thoughts with people who can think for themselves and give me an honest yrthful feedback. Its all about quality.

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Post by Stirky on Fri Jan 16, 2015 12:39 pm

Sure is Star, the media is corrupt, always has been. Finding the real truth in this world is hard, and most people just follow the pack. I am lucky to know many liberal thinkers whose minds and souls have not been brainwashed.
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Post by Agartha on Fri Jan 16, 2015 1:36 pm

@Stirky wrote:The right wing parties scare me! If they win too many seats at the election, we are in trouble, be a whole lot worse than Cameron!

I am a Green Party girl.... but they are never going to win. But you are right about the right wing parties, which are winning everywhere in Europe, actually.
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Post by Stirky on Fri Jan 16, 2015 2:11 pm

I just read something on facebook that says the green party are now in third place behind labour and the tories. I don't know how true this is mind. Would be good if it is! The right wingers are bad news!!
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Post by Agartha on Fri Jan 16, 2015 3:22 pm

Oh, that's interesting, I'll try to google it and see what I find...
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Post by Stirky on Fri Jan 16, 2015 3:33 pm

I think it is based on recent polls, but don't know how widespread they were or just a certain local area.
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Post by Stirky on Fri Jan 16, 2015 3:35 pm

As long as UKIP do not start overtaking the lib dems, we are ok! We won't even mention the BNP or Britain First!!!
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Post by Stirky on Fri Jan 16, 2015 4:14 pm

Huge queues today at certain newsagents for copies of Charlie Hebdo!! Probably mostly in London I should imagine.
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Post by Rogue on Fri Jan 16, 2015 4:57 pm


The Greens have long been the third party in Australia and NZ, often holding the balance of power. Powerful position!
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Post by Rockhopper on Fri Jan 16, 2015 10:40 pm

Yep Roggie they do.

There is a propensity in times of struggle for the Right wingers to gain more space. We are going through a Depression as bad as the one in the 30's and we saw what happened then, especially in Europe.

We are at the crossroads now where we must get ourselves out of this "Recession" or there will be another war. A war that will involve almost every country in the world and there will be no winners.

Tim.
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Post by Rogue on Fri Jan 16, 2015 11:29 pm


A war would suit some with oil prices so low.
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