Oceans Getting Hotter Than Anybody Realised...

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Post by Monk (in hiding) on Fri Oct 10, 2014 9:02 am

I don't belong here as I don't drink the same tea. I'm not group-think 'the island', I'm not a liberal, atheist, nor do I buy into the GW or Climate Change. I don't believe in Darwin's Evolution either.

It's me against the masses, conform or be ridiculed.

~logging off

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Post by Rockhopper on Fri Oct 10, 2014 12:46 pm

Wot agin?

Tim.
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Post by Mordae on Fri Oct 10, 2014 1:41 pm

VM wrote:I don't belong here as I don't drink the same tea. I'm not group-think 'the island', I'm not a liberal, atheist, nor do I buy into the GW or Climate Change. I don't believe in Darwin's Evolution either.

It's me against the masses, conform or be ridiculed.

~logging off
Nope, more a contrarian (is that a word?) but no surprises really...."regular programming will continue after this quick hissy-fit" Laughing sunny
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Post by Rogue on Fri Oct 10, 2014 5:35 pm


Mord you crack me up! Laughing
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Post by Lenzabi on Fri Oct 10, 2014 5:54 pm

We all do not agree 100% with each other as to how things are, and how to fix them. BUT of late VM has seemed to argue for the sake of just arguing, copy-paste is hardly arguing a point in any debate, one must also state their own personal take on the data being used, what they have interpreted of the info from the sources, critical thinking used to help an objective view of the data. My college courses only accepted the data from verifiable and or peer reviewed sites and data.

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Post by Rockhopper on Fri Oct 10, 2014 6:12 pm

Yeah Len. It's been a problem with him for a while. Perhaps something has happened in his life and he's brought his anger over here.

All I have ever asked of him is to back up what he says with legitimate sites not strange fringe conspiracy sites, but ones with good peer review and in recognised scientific journals. It's obvious what I have been saying -- stay out of those crazy fringe sites or they will do your head in.

There is no cover-up conspiracy in the scientific community, it's only in the minds of conspiracy theorists. There are many millions of true scientists out there and they would never be able to keep those sorts of secrets.

It's okay to have a differing view but in the fields of science back it up with genuine info not fringie stuff.

Tim.
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Post by Kaere on Fri Oct 10, 2014 6:17 pm

Thing is though Rock, this is not an exclusively science site. There's room here for all kinds of beliefs and understandings of the world and how it works. I don't think anyone should be put under pressure to have to "prove" anything to anyone, either for or against any subject. Agree to disagree, it's really that simple.
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Post by Lenzabi on Fri Oct 10, 2014 6:28 pm

I just ask that if you present things, copy-paste alone does nothing to show your views on the matter. It would help if he actually said, oh say, Based on going over this pasted item I found, and then gave us his views, interpretations, meanings or his understanding rather than his latest "You are all brainwashed idjits!" it may make for a valid argument, even if not all sciency, one needs to also present what makes them see it as a truth and convince others it is so, once the insults come out, you lose the argument is all, and that is common sense.

BUT also, if one is refuting a scientific item, then one must present the science that counters it, and that itself will be scientific in nature if it has validity. One cannot just go "Oh Evolution Theory is just plain Pooh pooh". It does not work that way. and it can take scientists themselves decades to change their minds if the refutation is valid, if not, they reject it totally and it is a moot point with them.

There is enough data to adjust for the slow evolution Darwin proposed, but also new finding seem to indicate catastrophic response in DNA, so if anything evolution may be merely tweaked but not thrown out.

But Rock merely asked for proofs, valid observations by VM of the data he spouted, and his own views to support the copy-pasted stuff. VM resorts to insults, and more copy-paste without any of his own words on the subject too much of the time.

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Post by Kaere on Fri Oct 10, 2014 6:38 pm

Hmm... I see what you mean. Fair enough Smile
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Post by Rockhopper on Fri Oct 10, 2014 7:02 pm

Scepticism is okay, scientists are sceptic by nature. And so am I. I also have a lifetime of experience to call on too. I know how ordinary men can move huge stones and blocks having done it myself (with others of course).

As a Structural Engineer I know about different alloys including Bronze and I know how hard they can be made. And how to design simple machines to help lift big weights. It's not difficult at all. And our ancestors were quite capable of working it out too.

Further, because I have an interest-nay passion for Archaeology I travelled to places like Egypt. Mesopotamia, and Central America and explored the sites for myself. I visited the museums where all the records are kept and read many of those records for myself.

I have no problem with the opinions of others and I enjoy discussing them too but when it comes down to what is known scientifically then people need to back up what they say by proper scientific data and peer reviews. And that's all I have ever asked of VM.

Tim.

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Post by Rockhopper on Fri Oct 10, 2014 8:28 pm

Anyway getting back OT. I see that Miami is having a serious issue with the sea. Apparently when there is a really high high tide some streets are going under water! Not surprising when the whole city is just above sea level.

They can't use Levees either because the limestone sub structure is so porous!

I can't see what they can do about it either short of moving the city to higher ground!

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Post by Monk (in hiding) on Sat Oct 11, 2014 11:16 am

I have left the Island due to one poster. I will not bow-down to narcissistic people, they will not control me. This is NOT bad astronomy forum.

This is why so many have left, acco, whitty to name a few and now vm.

Acolyte drove many away from 2012. Remember him?

I hold no grudges against any of you, it's just that I can't tolerate what has happened to this place. I feel as if I'm being drilled by a prosecutor and must prove to him everything in which I have disagreement.

This place has become not a place to share ideas, but a place in which one better 'fit into the agenda' our receive the wrath of god. Yes, go along with the program and your loved, otherwise forget it, your trash.

~logging off

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Post by Rockhopper on Sat Oct 11, 2014 2:12 pm

VM don't take things so personally. Yes, this is a place where we can share ideas but make them your ideas not those of others. Explain why and how you come the those conclusions in your own words mate.

When you have polarising ideas you will find that they polarise others, that's called life mate!

VM, I put up with your ad hominems and personal attacks for weeks until I had enough. You did the same at the old forum and you started it again here. And when I criticise you for that you storm off in a huff.

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Post by Mordae on Sun Oct 12, 2014 1:34 am

Worth the watch

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Post by Agartha on Sun Oct 12, 2014 5:35 am

Great video, and I  agree with the truth there. Those that do not believe we are pushing this warming with our insane use of coals and petrol, they do so because they don't want to stop living their easy lives.

One question though (sorry if I haven't researched, lol): after the Permian extinction when the planet got so warm, etc.... how did the weather got cold again? What triggered the cold?
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Post by Rockhopper on Sun Oct 12, 2014 2:59 pm

Very good question Ags! I suspect that the Methane/CO2 had gone from the atmosphere by the end of the Permian and the climate cooled down again. Also the land was one big pile at that time.

The Permian was followed by the Carboniferous so the climate had changed dramically. Pangaea had broken up and the wind and sea currents had changed too, that may have had an effect.

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Post by Agartha on Sun Oct 12, 2014 3:49 pm

Oh yeah, I had forgotten the Permian era was before Pangea divided.. which cannot help us with our current global warming as the conditions were completely different.
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Post by Rockhopper on Sun Oct 12, 2014 4:50 pm

They were Ags. It does give an indication what excess CO2 can start off.

The Permian was caused by a huge volcanic eruption in Siberia (Siberian Traps)and in Nth. India (Decan Traps). Imagine a volcanic rift erupting along a crack the same distance as from London to Madrid and doing so for hundreds of years. Hundreds of thousands of cubic kilometres of lava spewing out over that time.

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Post by Mordae on Sun Oct 12, 2014 6:05 pm

@Agartha wrote:Great video, and I  agree with the truth there. Those that do not believe we are pushing this warming with our insane use of coals and petrol, they do so because they don't want to stop living their easy lives.

One question though (sorry if I haven't researched, lol): after the Permian extinction when the planet got so warm, etc.... how did the weather got cold again? What triggered the cold?

Another factor that may have helped lower the temperature is turbidity (cloud cover) in the atmosphere reflecting light back into space.
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