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Post by Agartha on Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:05 am

Going around in circles......... I have already answered.
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Post by X on Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:05 am

Mr.W wrote:
@Agartha wrote:
Mr.W wrote:
Why would that one scientist create such a chemical...and how did that scientist package and sell the product to governments as a safe product?

How many chemicals are made today that are labeled safe...?

Whitty........are your reading what I'm posting????  I keep on repeating the same stuff!!! lol

When scientists created the first dispersants, which are toxic, they were using it on deserted land. When other scientists, specifically biologists, realized how toxic they were and lethal to animals and plants, they reported them and they were banned in many countries, except the US.

Governments test and check all products and label them safe but we know that profits rule whenever those 'labels' are made.

no...you are not reading my posts..............i will quote my post again next

agartha..you say profits rule....then scientific research is tainted!

How do you know you are getting correct research...or just paid research?

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Post by X on Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:07 am

@Agartha wrote:Going around in circles......... I have already answered.

Do you agree that most scientist work for profit and to make a name for themselves...which leads to "dirty products"

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Post by Agartha on Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:11 am

I have answered all that yesterday. Read my post regarding Einstein.
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Post by X on Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:12 am

Tell me in your own words in one sentence.

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Post by Monk (in hiding) on Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:12 am

Asbestos papers show health risks were known decades ago.

Letters, studies and other documents he wrote, received and stowed have been dubbed the Sumner Simpson Papers, and likened to the Pentagon Papers of the asbestos industry. They prove knowledge about the dangers of asbestos at the highest levels dating back eight decades.

The editor of an occupational journal sent Sumner a letter dated Sept. 25, 1935, seeking permission to publish an article about the hazards of asbestos.

“Always you have requested that for certain obvious reasons we publish nothing and naturally your wishes have been respected.”

On Oct. 1, 1935, Simpson wrote a note to his colleague Vandiver Brown, secretary of Johns-Manville Corp., the preeminent asbestos miner, manufacturer, seller and distributor in the Western world between the 1930s and the 1970s.

“I think the less said about asbestos the better off we are … “

Brown replied two days later, Oct. 3, 1935:

“I quite agree with you that our interests are best served by having asbestosis receive the minimum publicity.”


http://www.protectconsumerjustice.org/asbestos-papers-show-health-risks-were-known-decades-ago.html

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Post by Mordae on Mon Jul 14, 2014 2:59 am

@Agartha wrote:
Mr.W wrote:
Why would that one scientist create such a chemical...and how did that scientist package and sell the product to governments as a safe product?

How many chemicals are made today that are labeled safe...?

Whitty........are your reading what I'm posting????  I keep on repeating the same stuff!!! lol

When scientists created the first dispersants, which are toxic, they were using it on deserted land. When other scientists, specifically biologists, realized how toxic they were and lethal to animals and plants, they reported them and they were banned in many countries, except the US.

Governments test and check all products and label them safe but we know that profits rule whenever those 'labels' are made.

You'd think, but the NZ govt allowed the use of Corexit during the Rena oil spill.

Out of sight, out of mind Wink
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Post by Rockhopper on Mon Jul 14, 2014 5:47 am

Let me get this right Mr.W. All science is bad because of some rogue chemicals?

How many scientists can you name that are famous and/or rich? Not many! Most are ordinary people working away in the background. Not all are working for those nasty corporations.

Aren't you being a bit hypocritical? After all, like the rest of us, you use science to live. We all use it for work, to make a living and for entertainment as well as communication.

Look at the screen of your laptop, the LCD and think about the work that went into designing it, the Lithium battery that powers it. The technology that makes it work.

The internet and all the technology it takes to keep it going. The satellites that we use to communicate as well as those that give us warning of an impending storm. The cars we drive, the roads we drive on. The list goes on and on.

The antibiotics that make our lives better and save us from an early and often painful death.

All of these thing are the work of scientists, many of whom are toiling away unknown so our lives are the better for them.

Mr.W. I come from a time when children were still dying of diphtheria (our neighbour's son died of it). Polio killed many and crippled many more too. All that is behind us now because of scientists who worked away developing the vaccines necessary to control those afflictions. Small Pox is eradicated now (who knows for how long) because of science. In my lifetime I have seen the advances of so many things, mostly benefiting humankind and I have seen things that do not. One cannot pick and choose them all.

Tim.
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Post by Rockhopper on Mon Jul 14, 2014 5:50 am

@Mordae wrote:You'd think, but the NZ govt allowed the use of Corexit during the Rena oil spill.

Out of sight, out of mind Wink

Yup Mordman. Not surprising really with the bunch we have running the show at the moment. Perhaps there will be a change on the 20/9 (don't hold your breath though!).

Tim.
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Post by X on Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:45 am

Scientists create for profit..they will go where the money is...so all those things you mentioned rock mist have created huge profits

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Post by Rockhopper on Mon Jul 14, 2014 2:23 pm

Mr.W wrote:Scientists create for profit..they will go where the money is...so all those things you mentioned rock mist have created huge profits

Mr. W. You are emphasising the negatives and minimising the positives. Whether or not profits are generated is not the point, we all need to live. You trade your skills for profit as do I. You work to get the necessities of life as do I and every scientist does too.

And no, not all "Go where the the money is" either. Many still work in hospital and university labs and other place that are similar. Often for very little money.

Like it or not, we live in a world where profit rules and not all profit is bad. Would you rather live in a world where you children died of diphtheria or were crippled with Polio? A world where TB kills so many?

Before I asked you to name the scientists who are rich and famous, still nothing. If they all were rich and famous we all would know of them.

Tim.
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Post by Agartha on Mon Jul 14, 2014 3:11 pm

I agree with you, Rock.........people forget that all medicine and hospital equipments were also created by scientists.

Ever been ill? Ever had a loved one in hospital who needed a serious operation? Who do you think researched cures and made all those machines that save lives? Scientists.

My uncle had cancer and was saved thanks to medical advances......that's science too, and I am grateful.

I am also grateful for the internet, telephones, electricity, fridges, computers, etc.....all invented by scientists.

Do scientists also create bad stuff for profits? Yes, a minority do and some have created  things they thought were going to be good and then used for evil by governments and big companies ( I have explained that twice already, citing Eintein as an example).

But going after all scientists like a new Spanish Inquisition, that is morally wrong to my eyes.
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Post by Monk (in hiding) on Mon Jul 14, 2014 3:54 pm


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Post by Rinoa on Mon Jul 14, 2014 4:01 pm

I have a friend on a different spiritual forum, who is a scientist and does believe in god and all things spiritual
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Post by X on Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:48 pm

@Agartha wrote:I agree with you, Rock.........people forget that all medicine and hospital equipments were also created by scientists.

Ever been ill? Ever had a loved one in hospital who needed a serious operation? Who do you think researched cures and made all those machines that save lives? Scientists.

My uncle had cancer and was saved thanks to medical advances......that's science too, and I am grateful.

I am also grateful for the internet, telephones, electricity, fridges, computers, etc.....all invented by scientists.

Do scientists also create bad stuff for profits? Yes, a minority do and some have created  things they thought were going to be good and then used for evil by governments and big companies ( I have explained that twice already, citing Eintein as an example).

But going after all scientists like a new Spanish Inquisition, that is morally wrong to my eyes.

Lets discuss one of these scientists...and their gift to medical advances.....just name one..and lets follow the money trail.

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Post by Kaere on Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:52 pm

Frederick Banting, discovered insulin in 1921. Yes, big Pharma is making money from insulin but did Banting?

You don't need to change your thoughts on it or your point of view... but can you see my side of it?
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Post by X on Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:54 pm

You all act like these people are doing their jobs as a gift to humanity....they do it for money..like all of do our jobs...they will create good things..only if there is money and they will create bad..if there is money.

drop the money and lets see how much good they do

call me negative...i call it being real...

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Post by X on Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:57 pm

@Kaere wrote:Frederick Banting, discovered insulin in 1921. Yes, big Pharma is making money from insulin but did Banting?

You don't need to change your thoughts on it or your point of view... but can you see my side of it?

Frederick banting knew he would do well financially with this,.,,,and he also knew his career would fly too because of it

http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/medicine/laureates/1923/banting-bio.html

and yes..big pharma is raking in the dough...........and will continue to do so by doping the nations people....drop into your local clinic and see how quick they write you up an expensive prescription...the doctors make money by prescribing drugs

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Post by X on Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:58 pm

@Kaere wrote:Frederick Banting, discovered insulin in 1921. Yes, big Pharma is making money from insulin but did Banting?

You don't need to change your thoughts on it or your point of view... but can you see my side of it?

sure it was a good thing....but the financial benefits are the driving force behind the discovery

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Post by Kaere on Mon Jul 14, 2014 7:05 pm

I disagree with your points. You are speculating as to why Banting did what he did, for all you know he had relatives who had diabetes and his motives were entirely altruistic. And perhaps in other parts of the world it's true but doctors here in Canada are not allowed to take drugs kickbacks and they do not bill the Province (their employer) for prescriptions written.

I don't wish to continue in this discussion. Best of luck to all.
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