Re: Covid-19 Vaccine updates

[TrueCrazyLion]

Found this article on the progress of a vaccine just now - although it’s from last month:

https://www.ft.com/content/e5012891-58da-4a4f-8a05-182adf3ba0e2

Realistically, if the info here is correct, we’re looking at a vaccine becoming available in mid-2021 at the earliest... That’s if everything goes smoothly with trials etc.
Jeez. :-/

[Agartha]

Very interesting article! Well explained!

According to an article I read the other day (I can look for it tomorrow if you want, too tired now) the WHO is expecting a vaccine to be ready end of 2020 and the Oxford one seem to be number one in their list.

[TrueCrazyLion]

That’s what the FT article seems to say too, that a vaccine might be ready by the end of this year, and then it’ll be rolled out to all the most vulnerable people first and additional info on it will be gathered, which is expected to take at least another 6 months, before it’s made available to the general population. 

Yeah, that article you’re speaking about sounds really interesting! Would be great to see it

[Agartha]

I can't remember where I read it, but here is an article I found that says the same:

https://nairametrics.com/2020/10/07/covid-19-vaccine-likely-to-be-ready-by-december-who/

[TrueCrazyLion]

Wow... Nice!
That sounds very positive, they wouldn’t be saying it if they didn’t think they had a good reason to be optimistic.
It’s a great relief to see this, thanks for sharing!

[Agartha]

Lion, even after a vaccine has been approved we still have to see how everything works out, how long immunity lasts, find out if the virus is not mutating or mutating too quickly, identifying side effects that scientist may not see because trials were too short, etc etc.... this means we still have (at least) another year of having to be careful and living differently. 

Now I'll add something negative, but that needs to be said: as we have seen in the news a lot of people are against a Covid vaccine. If 100% of the population is vaccinated and the vaccine is approx 70% effective, it means we'll still have 30% of the population not protected. But if only 50% of the population is vaccinated, the immunised group will be very small.... that's another factor we need to consider and we still don't know how it will work out.

Return to the 'old' normal?... very slim chance of that in 2021 I think.

[TrueCrazyLion]

Yeah, well said - I’m expecting it to be a long time too before we start getting back to normal, as it’s such a massive undertaking to vaccinate(Or make enough doses of a working vaccine to vaccinate) a whole population.
Then there’s the part of society which, like you say, is against the vaccine and don’t believe the virus really exists etc(It’s beyond comprehension for me, but I know some people are strange to say the least! LOL), and they’ll most likely refuse to get vaccinated, which will allow the virus to continue spreading.

Yeah, the expectation is that immunity from a working vaccine won’t be permanent; we’ll need booster vaccinations as well. (The FT article was speculating that we’d need annual booster vaccinations, but personally I think we might need them more frequently than that.)
It’s been reported that COVID-19 is a slow-mutating virus, which is good news at least, and means it might be easier to get a handle on it faster in a scientific sense(Making a vaccine that works better for longer, etc).

[Rogue]

This looks a comprehensive article but i dont have time to read right now. Saving the link here for later.

https://theconversation.com/coronavirus-vaccine-what-we-know-so-far-a-comprehensive-guide-by-academic-experts-147881

[TrueCrazyLion]

Brilliant article, really well thought through, balanced and concise!
Great find!

[Agartha]

Excellent article and I agree with all the points made. I find the antivaxx section really useful as it has information I have not read yet, like the history of people having problems with vaccination.

[TrueCrazyLion]

This article I saw today looks promising, and suggests to me that at least one vaccine might be close to being approved, as they’re now speaking in terms of a timeframe of basically 2 months:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/uk-scotland-54573288

I like the balanced nature of the comments Kate Bingham has made too, suggests she’s got her finger on the pulse of what’s really going on.

[IceWendigo]

I am not getting any vaccines, I personnally know the owner of a pharmaceutical company who is not getting vaccinated. Getting information from different sources (not just media and pharma companies) is good idea. Cigarette companies knew their products effect on health, they simply didnt publish studies  that were contrary to their profits.

[Agartha]

hahaha sure, you speak to your friend's friend of a friend and I'll continue working with doctors and read peer reviewed analysis. I also have a cousin who owns a lab, so there you go, we both personally know people.

[IceWendigo]

"hahaha"

[Agartha]

You shouldn't edit your posts after someone has replied, that's sly and it says more about you than about those who reply in an honest way. 

Also, not true: thanks to scientists and their scientific methods we now know those products were harmful. Cigarettes were promoted by greedy imbeciles and backed by poor standard testing. 

Don't conflate science with marketing, two completely different things.

[IceWendigo]

I edit my post when ever I feel its not accurate, you can project any negative intent you want, I wont stop. Sorry if it causes displeasure. "scientists" are paid, some studies are not "paid" for hence you wont know about them, and finally of those that are funded only some studies are published, the WHO has studies it does not publish because Pharma/Foundations would cut their pay check. In Canada Monsanto offered two federal employees 2 million $ bribe each to approve a product.

Im not against vaccines nor against people injecting themselves with toluen or jumping off a bridge or self immolating with white phosphorus, as long as people have unbias information and dont force others to do the same.

[Agartha]

Please post evidence to back your first paragraph, regarding the Who, Monsanto etc. To have a proper discussion you need to back your words with data, dates, names and links. I can provide links for every statement I make. 


Thank you.

[TrueCrazyLion]

Not sure how much to read into this just yet, but there seems to be some reason for believing that a vaccine might be available in Scotland before the end of next month:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.glasgowlive.co.uk/news/glasgow-news/mass-coronavirus-vaccination-plan-scotland-19201353.amp

And that major progress is being made with plans to roll the vaccine out nationwide:

https://www.thenational.scot/news/18846529.plans-roll-covid-vaccine-across-scotland-well-advanced/ 

Hope these are both true!

[Agartha]

We were told this week that next month (or even end of November) we may be told we can start giving people the Covid19 vaccine. Apparently it will start with elderly in care homes and healthcare workers in both care homes and hospitals. But nothing is confirmed yet.

Two vaccines are ahead of the game in safety, both being at the end of phase 3 trials and having tested their vaccines in thousands of volunteers: Astrazeneca and Pfizer. It will be good to remind people that the vaccine is not 100% safe, just like any other vaccine, however, a severe reaction is only 1 in a million. 

The difference with this vaccine is that it has not been tested on millions of people for years, it's brand new and we still don't know if there are any long term effects. However, it has already been branded safe. And if we want to build immunity and go back to live a normal life, then we need people to be vaccinated. 

In the UK the vaccine will not be mandatory, just like any other vaccine.

[IceWendigo]

Sweden is able to have a normal life without vaccines (mortality is not worse than it has been in the past 20 years so this hysteria is not justified), i know two people who live there, so to me as you  probably know , equating vaccines with freedom, is corrupt authoritarian mafia blackmail. But at least its not mandatory, I worry about a 1984 Health Passport

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